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Unread 11-15-2016, 04:03 PM   #26
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I thought it suspicious that that sketch of Bernard kept the right lower corner hidden from us when they made it a point to show the "Delores" title on the bottom of hers.
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Unread 11-15-2016, 04:17 PM   #27
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i read this post and started to see the series
in my mind:

what happened to theresa?and Logan?

whats the purpose of ed harris character?
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Unread 11-15-2016, 11:14 PM   #28
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Well I'll be.

The one very subtle detail in "Westworld" that proves William is the Man in Black

Also...

https://www.moviefone.com/2016/11/15...-to-westworld/






.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 05:18 AM   #29
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spoiler concering the picture posted above.


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.
OK In this shot that wasn't used, (Yet) We see a few interesting things.

1. The new Logo.
2. The Knife (In the back case)

I suspect this is from a second trip to the park that we will see in the last episide. Assuming the 2 timeline theory is true, Then his company (Delos) bought West World.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 05:29 AM   #30
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Loved this most recent episode more than any of the previous ones.

Classic Hopkins in that last few minutes.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 10:29 AM   #31
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Yeah, not only was Ford and everyone else great, but there were some good answers.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 11:42 AM   #32
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Yeah I really liked the episode and it feels like they're progressing through the 'mysteries' at a faster pace than a show like LOST (due to only 10 episodes), which is nice.

I'm enjoying that they're focusing on a couple characters per episode, instead of trying to cram everyone into every episode (You have William/Dolores episodes, then MiB/Park Staff episodes).

The knife theory is good.. along with all the rest. I'm 100% convinced there are mutable timelines going on.. the last piece will be if William === MiB or if he's just a cog to get Dolores from A -> B. Logan could be the MiB as well.

My thinking is maybe Dolores kills William at the end, or William sacrifices himself to stop Dolores or something. Logan maybe decides to keep coming back to figure out what happened or something.

\\V/ clearly is earlier, before Delos bought it. \W/ says "A Delos Destination" below the logo, so it's after Delos came along. Guessing the "Company" William and Logan work for IS Delos, so one of them likely is involved in the buyout.. whichever that is probably turns into the MiB.

I just hope they pull off the reveal properly (like "What door?"), because otherwise it's just going to confuse/piss off a bunch of people.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 01:11 PM   #33
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This last episode also supported Bernard = Arnold when Bernard couldn't see the door but was shown being down in that basement before speaking with Dolores pre Ford's host making equipment.

Though it could also just be a version of Bernard that used to be able to see the door, or there used to be another way down or a hundred other different possibilities.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 01:43 PM   #34
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THe show is showing us the POV of the Hosts. Benard could not see the door (There was a wall then then the camera pans, Theresa says what's behing the door? Then we can see the door.

The picture of Arnold is also another clue, We see a younger Ford with "Arnold" who we later find out is actually a robot version of Ford's father.... But there is additional space in the photo. So if Benard is actual made in Arnold's image, then its a simple case of he couldn't reconize himself in the picture & when we see the picture again it will have 3 people in it.
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Unread 11-16-2016, 05:29 PM   #35
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logan is the MIB--- im more inclined to that theory. how he treats Dolores in the first episodes and how he treats the hosts along his journey are similar. now the question is.what happened to William =
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Unread 11-21-2016, 12:05 AM   #36
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More evidence?

Quote:
"It's you. I figured they'd retire you"
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Unread 11-21-2016, 10:13 AM   #37
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Yeah when I saw him recognize the girl from the entry way.. well, that confirms mutable timelines at least.

There is no way (of course SOME way, mutable copies of hosts, etc) that she could be the intake girl for William AND out there in Wyatt's quest line at the same time. So William HAD to have come earlier than the MiB. It's not a slam dunk William=MiB, but it's getting there.

I was hoping he'd tie something in when he was talking to Teddy, but nothing seemed to really click for me. Other than he got married 30 years go (Ties into Williams timeline).

The scenes with Dolores were all over the place.. so I THINK the town was there at the beginning, then buried when she visited it with William, and then back under construction when she visited it alone (MIB timeline)?
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Unread 11-21-2016, 11:04 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSA
The scenes with Dolores were all over the place.. so I THINK the town was there at the beginning, then buried when she visited it with William, and then back under construction when she visited it alone (MIB timeline)?
That's what I gathered too.

- pre William
- with William
- later

It's also starting to look like MiB and Teddy are in the future on their Wyatt mission, or at least past the leaked info storyline of Ford/Bernard/Teresa/Hale considering that they are still working on creating the Wyatt storyline.

Where is Dolores during MiB and Teddys Wyatt mission? Am I forgetting or have they not let us know...yet?

I'm forgetting the details of the Maeve storline, so I'm not sure where to place her. It might be a completely different time period!

Between the different time periods and all the flashbacks, sheesh, so much to keep track of.
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Unread 11-21-2016, 11:30 AM   #39
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Yeah it is getting confusing a little. Not sure if it'll impact things or not, but hopefully they do a good job at catching the audience up to speed in a good way (a la "what door?").

MiB + Teddy met with Ford at the cantina remember? They talked about Wyatt a little bit, so it was unclear if the new narrative was done or was being worked on still. I hadn't previous thought about it taking place in the 'near' future, but that is a real possibility. My thinking is it's still a work in progress, since we haven't actually seen Wyatt yet, he doesn't need to be ready yet. I don't understand the Wyatt henchmen.. they seem bulletproof?


"Diet Thor" aka the Security Guy (He's a Hemsworth brother) interacted with the MiB (approving his explosive cigars, letting him take down the posse etc. Diet Thor also interacted with Hale/Bernard/Theresa so I'm guessing that means they're all connected in the same time-frame. We also saw Ford give Teddy the "Wyatt" memory, and shortly thereafter he tells Dolores he can't go with her that day because he's escorting that lady on the Wyatt hunt.. he ends up getting captured and tied up and that's where the MiB finds him (with Lawrence).

During this time, I THINK, Dolores returns home w/out Teddy (since he's on the hunt) and she has the weird flashbacks and ends up shooting Trevor (GTAV). After this we see her run off, and the show makes you think she ran off and met William. If that is actually the past, then Dolores ran off and is now retracing her steps, alone.

She's walking alone in Pariah in the parade, she's alone on the train for a moment, she's alone at the little village in the last episode. Teddy doesn't know where she is either. There's a scene where Diet Thor says shes off-loop, where she was talking to the little girl at the Mexican villa, and they said they couldn't tell if she was with a guest or not.. again we're led to believe she's with William, but it really seems like it's two timelines.

One where she went with William the first time, and now following the same path trying to get back to.. whatever.

Pretty sure we saw Maeve & the techs with someone else in the 'present' timeline, though I'm not 100% sure. The preview for next week shows..

Spoiler
Maeve and Bernard interacting, looks like current day
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Unread 11-21-2016, 11:51 AM   #40
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Everyone is in current day except the William timeline.

I think the new narative is the beginning of Medieval World! or the series version of it.

Felix not sure if I posted it here or not.
Spoiler
Look at the robot heads behind Ford's desk
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Unread 11-21-2016, 03:15 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NSA View Post
Yeah it is getting confusing a little. Not sure if it'll impact things or not, but hopefully they do a good job at catching the audience up to speed in a good way (a la "what door?").
My hope, at the very least, is that they are REALLY paying attention and leaving zero plot holes. I want to go back and rewatch and not be able see where they screwed up.

Quote:
MiB + Teddy met with Ford at the cantina remember?
Yep. As long as Ford doesn't die, it could still be the future...unless I'm forgetting some other Ford interaction/conversation that throws it all out of the window.

Quote:
"Diet Thor" aka the Security Guy (He's a Hemsworth brother) interacted with the MiB (approving his explosive cigars, letting him take down the posse etc. Diet Thor also interacted with Hale/Bernard/Theresa so I'm guessing that means they're all connected in the same time-frame. We also saw Ford give Teddy the "Wyatt" memory, and shortly thereafter he tells Dolores he can't go with her that day because he's escorting that lady on the Wyatt hunt.. he ends up getting captured and tied up and that's where the MiB finds him (with Lawrence).
As long as Stubbs continues to exist into the future, his interactions don't disprove (or prove) anything else. Ugh. The way they jump around, even from the same character in different time periods in the VERY NEXT SCENE...impossible to figure anything out.

Quote:
During this time, I THINK, Dolores returns home w/out Teddy (since he's on the hunt) and she has the weird flashbacks and ends up shooting Trevor (GTAV). After this we see her run off, and the show makes you think she ran off and met William. If that is actually the past, then Dolores ran off and is now retracing her steps, alone.

She's walking alone in Pariah in the parade, she's alone on the train for a moment, she's alone at the little village in the last episode. Teddy doesn't know where she is either. There's a scene where Diet Thor says shes off-loop, where she was talking to the little girl at the Mexican villa, and they said they couldn't tell if she was with a guest or not.. again we're led to believe she's with William, but it really seems like it's two timelines.
I like this! If it weren't for William scenes w/o Dolores, I'd think the William stuff was all flashback.

Wonder why shes being allowed to wonder wherever the heck she want's to.
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Unread 11-21-2016, 04:13 PM   #42
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Yeah. I don't know, I'd need to watch it again to look and see if there is any more overlap, though there is clear overlap (Ford/Stubbs/MiB), where as the William // MiB has zero overlap.

I'm not even sure you could really show a time difference in those two arcs.. since it could be anytime. A time difference of a couple weeks to a year really wouldn't benefit much I don't think. the ~30 year difference between William/MiB would be easier to portray.

The board member said to that guy that he was basically doing busy work since Ford was almost done. I guess it's something to keep an eye on, but that'd be harder to pass on as important I think.

Though anything is possible with this show.

In that one scene the control people couldn't tell if Dolores was with a guest or not, I assume if they think she's with someone they let them have their fun. The oversight in general seems very poor in Westworld with all the shit that's going on. Though it's hard to tell if things are that way, or things are covered up so well it seems that way.

The creators had said they wanted the show to typically be told "from the host" point of view, not the guests, so things can be skewed.
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Unread 11-21-2016, 07:30 PM   #43
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Seems pretty linear to me except the interviews with Dolores and Bernard. Especially the one that took place the night she entered the new town and stayed with Wiliam. Seems like it couldn't have happened that night.
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Unread 11-22-2016, 10:39 AM   #44
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Lies!

Yes, he looks much different in those, less formal than he normally does.
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Unread 11-28-2016, 11:46 AM   #45
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Well. That was a LOT of reveals/confirmations last night.

Wonder if Bernard/Ford set Stubbs up considering he was suspecting something was fishy.

Dolores - "Are we very old friends?"
Ford - "No, I wouldn't say that. I wouldn't say that at all."

So are they not friends because Ford MADE Dolores kill Arnold or are they not friends because she killed Arnold because her or Arnold decided to?
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Unread 11-29-2016, 01:05 PM   #46
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My theory right now is Elsie is alive somehow, since we see Bernard choking her, but not explicitly her death. Maybe she had some code word or something to stop him? Maybe she enabled her transmitter to try and get Stubbs there to help her.. maybe she got the Indians on her side too?

I feel like there would be better ways for Ford to off Stubbs than send him somewhere that he publicly tells people where he's going.

So much good stuff in the episode though.

MIB=William is all but confirmed now. The door is slightly open for MIB=Logan instead, but I'm not sure how that'd work.

3 time periods at work = mostly confirmed.

Pre-Park (Arnold) time period (34 years ago): Testing the park, testing the hosts, Arnold is alive.

William time period (30 years ago): Arnold has died already, Delos hasn't bought the park yet. The "incident" should happen here.

Delos Staff time period (Present): Ford, New Narrative, MiB & Charlotte.

It'll be interesting to see how they fill in the time gap.. that's a long time for things to go fine before breaking again.
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Unread 11-29-2016, 04:43 PM   #47
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I need to go back and watch when MIB kills Delores again now that it's confirmed. She certainly was not happy to see him in the church. Now that we know the maze is to Arnold's workshop, we know why the hosts keep telling MIB the maze isn't for him. So if the church is buried, how is it MIB and Delores meet in it?
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Unread 11-29-2016, 07:35 PM   #48
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Ford's new story involved digging up the old town where the incident happened

In the young willian era, it was buried after Arnold was killed there
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Unread 11-29-2016, 08:46 PM   #49
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Lot of loose ends to tie up in this last episode.

- Elsie and Stubbs
- the incident
- Maeve revolt story
- Abernathy resurrection along with Lee and Charlotte's plan for him
- MiB, Dolores, William, Logan
- the maze
- ?
- ?
- ?
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Unread 11-30-2016, 11:21 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcsguy88 View Post
I need to go back and watch when MIB kills Delores again now that it's confirmed. She certainly was not happy to see him in the church. Now that we know the maze is to Arnold's workshop, we know why the hosts keep telling MIB the maze isn't for him. So if the church is buried, how is it MIB and Delores meet in it?
Yeah, it was their original test town before the park opened, then an incident happened, so they buried the town. When William & Dolores made their way there, it was buried. In the first couple episodes, we see Ford there and it's still buried, but he started excavating it and rebuilding the town.

When Dolores got there in present day, it's partially rebuilt, but there is no one there yet. That's when the MiB shows up.

It is kind of confusing with all the time jumps, and unreliably narrator/perspective.
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