Election day...

NSA

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It is still amazing the disparity between cities and rural areas. What is it about grouping people together that makes them vote democrat? Like Montana.. it's a mostly red red red state, but you get to the cities and they still vote 60-70-80% democrat. I picked Montana to rule out just the minority influence. Helena, Montana is 93.47% white (as of last count). You see the same thing in Missoula.. or really any other 'city' in any state in the nation (even in TN!).

On flyover it looks very red.. but you have whole counties with less than 1,000 votes total.

I appreciate the electoral college not giving the megacities all the power.. but realistically we need to figure out why cities cause people to vote dem almost 100% of the time.
 

nacho

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Because poverty. People who don't own homes/land typically live in metro areas because that's where the rental property is. Those are often the people who either haven't climbed the ladder yet or failed to do so. Even ruling out the racial aspect, inner-city residents are less affluent than their suburban counterparts.

People who have little are far more inclined to vote for the candidate that's giving stuff away. Those who have something tend to vote for the candidates who promise to take the least.
 
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NSA

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But how do you counter that? How do you make people un-poor? Seems like revving up the economy and adding jobs is a good start.. but some poor people are poor for a reason (bad with money, etc) and no matter how much you try to help them they'll never move into content republican territory.

Add to the fact that poor city folk are, I guess, reproducing faster than 'nice country folk' and you have recipe for republican disaster.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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Looking at my precinct and literally the one on the other side of the street. Both in the same city. Both white suburbs aside from an apartment complex on the outskirts of mine. My precinct, 61% Clinton win, the one on the other side of the street, 47% Trump win. I guess it really is poverty vs. not as they tipped the scales in favor HRC in a BIG way.
 

nacho

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NSA, that's exactly the big dilemma on everyone's mind. Some people will be poor no matter how much they're given. Those are the takers that give most republicans nightmares. If government assistance was a helping hand upward in a temporary fashion, I think you'd get near-universal support.

But poor people gonna poor. Large numbers have become increasingly good at gaming the system, and that's what a crap-ton of hard working people are pissed about when they vote republican. I don't agree with everything the R's do. I care about the environment, net-neutrality, and helping those truly in need. But I can't care about those things to the extent that I'll vote for a party that wants to bleed me dry so they can effectively buy votes with it. Republican politicians are just as inept and corrupt as those on the other side. They're just not socialists on top of it.
 

NSA

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Yeah that's what it pretty much comes down to. If people get 'comfortable' being poor, they have no incentive to do better for themselves or work upward. I don't think the poor should be punished, but there has to be some kind of way to keep them moving and not let them stagnate.

If everyone can afford a big TV and a car and drinking money, on or off the government dime.. why would they bust their asses for more? We're already so lazy, it just makes it so much easier to sit back and not care. Once you're there, you'd rather keep your comfortableness (Democrat promises) than get a better chance at a better life (Republican promises).

The other wacky political crap is just different flavored seasoning on the shit sandwich. Gays! Trans! Abortion! Church! None of it really impacts you in a day-to-day manner like the economy, but it gets people to 'take a side', sometimes against their own self interests.
 

ThunderDan19

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My district at the time went 54% to HRC. Where we have since moved was 64% DJT.

Here's hoping that with the thousands of minions of the previous administration being evicted from northern VA, it'll go red again. But, that may be too much to ask, as many of the lifelong gubment types still reside up there. They will always vote to protect/grow their parasitic organism.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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Guess I understand the forced HUD housing and apartment complexes now. All the left needs to do is a little math. Then if they can plop enough of those into a borderline red area, they quickly change even the more rural areas. Seriously, the difference in my precinct to the one next door is apartments. One has them. One does not. Find out how many additional votes you need to win an area and add poverty housing until you get the results you want. Maybe drop some legals/illegals in.

Looking at the map, though, they have a loooooooot of work to do. Guess that explains all of the 3rd world immigrants they desperately want.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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So our primaries are coming up next week. I've become adamantly against voting for any dem because I oppose so much of what they like doing. But I've/we've got a dilemma. We have positions where no R or L are running. Should I research the Ds and pick the lesser of however many evils there are?
 

ThunderDan19

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So I got this survey the other day (I like online surveys - get to express my opinions on a bunch of things and get a little cash out of it) about the upcoming House race in (what used to be) my district. They gave me a bunch of these possible statements that the Dem opposing Dave Brat could potentially use to try to counter the argument that Dems choose to support MS 13 and sanctuary cities over law enforcement and the American people. Long story short, there is absolutely nothing they could say that would make me vote any Dem over Brat as long as he continues down the same path he has thus far. Only sad thing is that with our recent move he's no longer our rep. But I hope I did my part to inform the Dems (who obviously paid for the survey) of how futile it is to try to pull in independent, conservative, free-thinking, patriotic Americans with their obvious anti-American platforms and policies, no matter how they try to spin it.
 
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ThunderDan19

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Oh, I'm fully used to handling manipulated surveys. I get them all the time from corporations (particularly banks for some reason) that want to promote something as much as find out people's opinions of them. I didn't give the Dems all "I HATE EVERYTHING ABOUT YOU" answers so they wouldn't completely disregard it as a full blown GOP answering. I gave them enough to think they might have had some influence and then repeated my choice for Brat every time they re-asked the same "with this new information who would you vote for?" question.
 

K-Tiger

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He seems to have been born again hard. Cool to see, though I'm still leery. As an aside, you know McCain would have fucked this up out of spite.
 
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nacho

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nacho

Have you seen this one?

Ha, no I hadn't seen it. Been at the beach in FL for a week, focused on seafood and making sure the hurricane wasn't going to turn my way. I haven't even seen any non-weather news in over a week. Just rolled in this evening, trying to adjust being back in the real world.

Not surprised about the Dems though. We're one of those places that was part of the democrat's "solid south" for decades, but over the last 25 -30 years has morphed to consistently red. Republicans in the state legislature have a "super majority" in both houses and a popular republican governor, so they just do absolutely anything they want - fortunately, it's the things you'd hope for. The Dems just waste their time even showing up.
 

NSA

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So I guess they're saying the Dems win the house, GOP keeps the Senate. So more gridlock, yay!

Interesting reading Nachos first post in this thread now.. it really seems like everyone in this country has started just voting for their side, regardless of who the person is, how qualified, etc. Its turned into rooting for YOUR sports team, with zero nuance.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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I mean, the D's are openly advocating for full on socialism, open borders, 2nd repeal, 1st restrictions, opposing LE etc etc. How can you not vote against that?

Shame more people can't see it and we're going to have more of the same for at least another two years.
 

nacho

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Well, here in TN, we did our part. Republican Governor, Senator, and Congressman. And to NSA's point, I think they were the most qualified/best-platformed, not just blind party voting. We even elected our first female senator. HOW PROGRESSIVE WE'VE BECOME!

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K-Tiger

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So I guess they're saying the Dems win the house, GOP keeps the Senate. So more gridlock, yay!
The Republicans have sat on their fat asses for two years, so the Dems winning the house means all of nothing for legislation passing.

Pretty ashamed of my state. That a Republican in Texas should win by so small a margin against a plastic paddy with a Latino-pandering nickname sickens me deeply.
 

ThunderDan19

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Yeah, lots of globalist billionaire money contributed to the Cruz squeaker and also the loss for Rep. Brat here in VA by 5K votes, among others. I guess I should be happy I no longer live in that district. I'm pretty ashamed that we keep electing Tim Kaine to stuff too. VA has been polluted purple and tainted by corrupt RINOs. And we've now managed to lose our one solid conservative rep (who dislodged a prominent RINO, and was never forgiven or supported by the House GOP). We (VA) are most definitely headed the wrong direction.

The bright side is that the Senate (and the House for that matter) has now been cleansed of a lot of the RINOs now and shored up to ensure judge and justice appointments. Now we just need Ginsberg (and Breyer for that matter) to hurry up and bow out.
 

NSA

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So even though they lost the house, increasing in the Senate means more Supreme nominations can go through pretty easily? That seems like the exact opposite of what the Dems wanted.

And yes.. Republicans did ALMOST shit-all with majorities in both houses AND the Presidency (also, see GWB presidency, Obama presidency). I SWEAR there is some kind of unspoken rule that no one actually does anything when they can, instead waiting until 'gridlock' forces them to.. not do anything. It's ridiculous, and happens on both sides.. and I don't get it.

Regarding this election.. it seems to be pretty standard for the 'opposition' to win seats in off-years, everyone likes to complain about the people in power (see: Dems in '08, Tea Party in '10 and '12).. so I'm not really surprised, especially considering how "motivated" the left base was.

All that being said, it really does feel like everyone and everything is becoming extremely polarized, and I don't know if it'll ever change at this point. No one listens to people with opposing viewpoints, giving them the chance to change their mind. They hammer out facts and figures and emotional reasons for whatever.. and that's that. You're either with us, or you're with the ENEMY!

In the craziness yesterday, I saw someone on the Right that I follow on Twitter (great barometer, I know) call the voters on the left "subhumans" unironically. Like.. what.. I feel that since the "radical" left has taken hold, a bunch of people on the right have either felt compelled (or finally free) to go radical right. That is not, and should not, be the answer.. but just as the left refuses to condemn ANTIFA and the like, the Right lets our crazies get a pass most times too.. under the auspices of "well they're on our side..". I really feel like this nonsense is stretching the usability of the 2-party system.