Who Should Be the JOEs Breakout Character?

Fred Broca

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One of the good things about The Rock picking Roadblock is that some secondary JOEs got some shine in the movies. If it were up to me and I were going a JOE franchise these are some of the JOEs I would focus on.

Chuckles-I would have Chuckles be the JOE equivalent to Bond/Jason Bourne. He would mainly be one solo intelligence opts and his liaison with the JOE team would Scarlett, Lady Jaye, and Law. For a movie I would spin these characters off into some shit like Winter Solider.

COBRA Commander-I've shared my ideas for a a franchise before, but to recap for a movie, one of the movies would focus on C.C. his motivations and how founded and grew COBRA into a ruthless terrorist organization determined to rule the world.

Stalker-Instead changing the race of character, I'd just use one of the seminal characters in the JOE universe Stalker.

Quick Kick-Simply because it would be an excuse to give him a new uniform. Also, the running gag with QK would be the JOEs would mistakenly make references to him to being a ninja, to which QK would say he's not a ninja, he's never studied ninjustu, and his discipline is Tae Kwon Do.

The Siegies-Considering the route Retaliation took, I'm surprised that we see the Twins or at least the Crimson Guard. I would have the Siegie moles in the world's governments and other spheres of power and influence.
 

Videoviper

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Quick Kick-Simply because it would be an excuse to give him a new uniform. Also, the running gag with QK would be the JOEs would mistakenly make references to him to being a ninja, to which QK would say he's not a ninja, he's never studied ninjustu, and his discipline is Tae Kwon Do.
I use this running joke with Tunnel Rat, except he says I'm from Brooklyn & my family runs a chinese take out restaurant.

:trollface:

Would love to see different Joes get more story time, but they need to keep Joe on the air.

I'd like the next Joe series to be a continuation of Renegades. Or if they don't want that route.....

Start with the Downfall of Cobra, Cobra Commander pleads with an unseen council for help, as GI Joe invades Cobra Island presumably the last stronghold for Cobra. They are defeated. For time there is peace, but in the shadows a new order arises.

This allows the ARAH to be part of the story while continuing onward for the next generations, allowing past characters to come back as needed while passing the torch.

Sub plots can include where are known enemies now. (Was Destro ever outed as James McCullen.) If Serpentor is dead, who is this new clone & how many are there?
 

Fred Broca

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Start with the Downfall of Cobra, Cobra Commander pleads with an unseen council for help, as GI Joe invades Cobra Island presumably the last stronghold for Cobra. They are defeated. For time there is peace, but in the shadows a new order arises.

This allows the ARAH to be part of the story while continuing onward for the next generations, allowing past characters to come back as needed while passing the torch.
Piggybacking on this, the JOEs need a new enemy.
 

Giga Bread

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I was thinking a neat story would be if GI Joe was dealing with isolated threats all over the place while Cobra is busy kicking ass in the middle of the Iraqi/Syrian conflict.

Maybe a new enemy could be a Chinese equivalent of the Oktober Guard.

As for characters, I kind of wish they would go with some new characters that honor the character structure of the line circa 81-85. Meaning, I want to see new characters, I don't want to see 18 year old genius skate boarders with teen angst.

A couple characters I wouldn't mind seeing being reimagined.

Psyche Out. Knowing what psychological warfare really is, I'd like for him to be reimagined and veered away from Mysterio.

Budo. As a SGFp commander. Not a samurai. He could be a natural leader in the Asian theater.
 

Giga Bread

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Also, I don't want to see Chuckles as a Bond type character because I just love his character in the IDW series.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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I was thinking a neat story would be if GI Joe was dealing with isolated threats all over the place while Cobra is busy kicking ass in the middle of the Iraqi/Syrian conflict.

Maybe a new enemy could be a Chinese equivalent of the Oktober Guard.

As for characters, I kind of wish they would go with some new characters that honor the character structure of the line circa 81-85. Meaning, I want to see new characters, I don't want to see 18 year old genius skate boarders with teen angst.

A couple characters I wouldn't mind seeing being reimagined.

Psyche Out. Knowing what psychological warfare really is, I'd like for him to be reimagined and veered away from Mysterio.

Budo. As a SGFp commander. Not a samurai. He could be a natural leader in the Asian theater.
Also, I don't want to see Chuckles as a Bond type character because I just love his character in the IDW series.
Dig all those thoughts. I'd add in North Korea as a threat, but they are rather small compared to something the likes of China.
 

Fred Broca

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Maybe a new enemy could be a Chinese equivalent of the Oktober Guard.
That would be dope.

Budo...As a SGFp commander.
What's a SGFp commander?

Also, I don't want to see Chuckles as a Bond type character because I just love his character in the IDW series.
I haven't read that yet. What was he doing in the IDW series?

Dig all those thoughts. I'd add in North Korea as a threat, but they are rather small compared to something the likes of China.
Eddie is over here trying to get the lives of Hasbro's C level officers threaten and their e-mail account hacked.
 

K-Tiger

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Special Forces Group. Japanese Ground Self-Defence Force's counter-terrorist unit. It actually make sense to make Budo a foreign operator on assignment to the Joe team, much like Big Ben or Skymate.
 

Giga Bread

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I haven't read that yet. What was he doing in the IDW series?



.

He wasn't like Bourne or Bond in that he wasn't a super badass soldier. He was deep cover in the upper echelon of Cobra. If you're familiar with the series Sleeper, it had a similar feel.
 

Fred Broca

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He wasn't like Bourne or Bond in that he wasn't a super badass soldier. He was deep cover in the upper echelon of Cobra. If you're familiar with the series Sleeper, it had a similar feel.
I haven't watched Sleeper, but I from your response I basically figured it. Chuckles, was basically a JOE equivalent to a Siegie. Hell, that would be a dope idea for a JOE Net Flix spin off series.

The more I think about it, the more I realize that in order for the JOE brand to maximize it's earning potential, Hasbro, (instead of swimming against the current,) needs to realize three important factors

1) Boys between the ages of 8-12 don't play with action figures as they did in years past.

2) The most successful incarnation of G.I. JOE was the A Real American Hero of the brand who bought JOE's when they between the ages of 8-12 back in the 80's.

The conundrum for Hasbro is that they want to sell their army men to the 8-12 year old boy demographic, but the guys who want buy JOEs want a more realistic version of the characters and the accessories.

For what I see Hasbro has choice, (and I've said this before on numerous occasions,) embrace what G.I. JOE is and give the fandom what they want, a 21st Century special forces unit with figures in realistic uniforms and accessories, with some hi tech elements, and somebody with a a military background or extensive military knowledge doing the files cards.

However, if Hasbro were to do this some busy body bitch in from Berkeley, CA or New York will pass herself off as a "child advocate," group shoot a letter to Hasbro, Walmart, T 'R U or Target saying the Joe line promotes war, they're inappropriate for kids, COBRA is making little Johnny violent, C.C.'s hood resembles a Klansman hood.
 

Giga Bread

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Well, I think they can do both.

Kids love super heroes more right now. I've said it before, but they should take advantage of having the Marvel line, and reinvent a GI Joe that is similar in concept to Stormwatch Team Achilles, but geared to kids and stripped of the political aspects. That book was out at the same time as Sleeper and followed an international special forces group designed to counter super powered beings.

The thing Hasbro hasn't figured out is that they can make a separate line of realistic military and most adult fans will buy both lines. If there's a joe I didn't grow up with but looks good sitting on the shelf next to my other figures because they use similar parts structures, I'll be more than happy. The shittiest lines they've done have been bought up by fans who complain about them constantly online. I just don't want colors that burn through my primer.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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Eddie is over here trying to get the lives of Hasbro's C level officers threaten and their e-mail account hacked.
:trollface:

Don't be skerd Hasbro execs!

I'm with you Fred. They need to stop trying to sell toys to ADHD kids who don't care about toys. And if they do, don't care about one particular toy line for more than 5 minutes.

Instead focus on a serialized TV/Netflix/premium TV show for adults who actually know and love the brand and deliver a higher quality collectable. Not premium priced, rubbery plastic'd, crappy paint app'd figures for kids who have no interest. JOE a is much more suited to TV than it is to film.



.
 
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Videoviper

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The conundrum for Hasbro is that they want to sell their army men to the 8-12 year old boy demographic, but the guys who want buy JOEs want a more realistic version of the characters and the accessories.

For what I see Hasbro has choice, (and I've said this before on numerous occasions,) embrace what G.I. JOE is and give the fandom what they want, a 21st Century special forces unit with figures in realistic uniforms and accessories, with some hi tech elements, and somebody with a a military background or extensive military knowledge doing the files cards.
.
Talk to an army kid, they would love an action figure of Dad, but that's not what the 80's version of GI Joe is. So they don't invest in it.

There is a whole phycology that is either misunderstood or misused.
Yes Hasbro marketed the heck out of GI Joe/Transformers in the 80s & they did go into some grey areas with what they could & could not do. What many fans don't realize is that they changed the law on how to market kids toys because of practices of many in the 80's.

Can't show toys moving & talking if they don't.
Can't make claims, that are iffy... (*Slave 1's locking wings)


That being said what can Hasbro do?

Well you may not be able to play commicials on network TV advertising a related Joe product (cough the Joe Comic commericals were really about the toys)
But you could make commericals & put them out on the net, without the restrictions of network TV.

Hasbro has been looking into building up an entertainment division (Hasbro Studios) which could market several series, movies & other products.
Why not include a web series, & a video games series (Not just one)

The idea is to place GI Joe & Transformers in front of kids, get them to talk about it. (Not the 40 year olds on hisstank; sorry but they harm the cause more than help it.) To paraphase one of the 80's marketers, teach the kids how to play with the toys & they will want to play with them.

If they are playing the newest Joe game then they might want action figures.

Renegades biggest issue, was that the toys were almost an after thought, as they came out months after the show premiered, Which lost us a wave 2 or 3 of toys.

Modernize the toys. Leave the 80's stuff to the "collector's" club

Give them a storyline, via comics, movies TV, web the point is get it in front of the kids. Make the kids inverted in the product

Give the story a hero, moral grounding so that it can't just be labeled as a war toy, because GI Joe has always been more than that.

Make if fun, because this stuff should be for kids, (Colectors 2nd)
 

WVMojo

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There's a fine line between scrapping the ARAH and coming up with something completely new.

Military with Sci-fi aspects is what the 80's Joes are all about. That's something they could really embrace with futuristic technology (not that nano-mite stuff).

I think a show could be done that has the 80's Joes as senior military officers in charge of a new generation of recruits. Much like how the X-men movies were formulated with the core team being older and more experienced. You could still introduce characters from the ARAH canon as younger versions.

Make Cobra the anti-ISIS...instead of taking over countries by force and extreme measures, they take over and gain loyalty through humanitarian efforts and bringing prosperity and stability to war torn countries, which gains them soldiers and loyal followers. Make them a private company like what they were doing with Renegades
 

Topside

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There's a fine line between scrapping the ARAH and coming up with something completely new.

Military with Sci-fi aspects is what the 80's Joes are all about. That's something they could really embrace with futuristic technology (not that nano-mite stuff).

I think a show could be done that has the 80's Joes as senior military officers in charge of a new generation of recruits. Much like how the X-men movies were formulated with the core team being older and more experienced. You could still introduce characters from the ARAH canon as younger versions.

Make Cobra the anti-ISIS...instead of taking over countries by force and extreme measures, they take over and gain loyalty through humanitarian efforts and bringing prosperity and stability to war torn countries, which gains them soldiers and loyal followers. Make them a private company like what they were doing with Renegades
I think the Renegades Cobra/ Advanced Warfare Atlas model works best for the world we live in. Great way to make Joes relevant again.
 

Fred Broca

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The thing Hasbro hasn't figured out is that they can make a separate line of realistic military and most adult fans will buy both lines.
Parroting something that's been said on another message board that we all know and "love," but sadly makes sense, are JOE collectors enough in their 40's, 30's, and possibly late 20's enough to not only sustain the brand, but grow it?

I'm of the school of thought that Hasbro employs some pretty smart people that have MBA's and post graduate degrees in marketing from Ivy League institutions that have looked long and hard at the very thing that we're talking about.

I'm pretty sure that somebody at Hasbro has not only heard that there's a demand for something along the ARAH brand, but somebody monitors these message boards and they've discussed at length this very topic. It's it fair to say that since we haven't seen anything more to our liking is because the people at Hasbro feels that a new version of the ARAH brand or something geared towards the collectors won't be profitable?

(Not the 40 year olds on hisstank; sorry but they harm the cause more than help it.)
Elaborate on that.

To paraphase one of the 80's marketers, teach the kids how to play with the toys & they will want to play with them.

If they are playing the newest Joe game then they might want action figures.
In theory, but wouldn't that kid just play a video game version of G.I. JOE?

Leave the 80's stuff to the "collector's" club
But does this make $ense for Hasbro?

Give them a storyline, via comics, movies TV, web the point is get it in front of the kids. Make the kids inverted in the product
I personally don't see why Hasbro can't give us more Direct to DVD animated flicks. That would be hot.
 

Giga Bread

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There's a contingent of fans who will always buy in secret. They will maintain a status quo that isn't as profitable as they want it to be and will never grow the brand. I'm completely comfortable with them making 4" military fiction figures more profitable and target kids again, even if it isn't my cup of Joe. I'll at least use the parts.
 

WVMojo

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I agree Hasbro has more statistical data on toys than we could imagine...they have to gear it towards kids in order to make it grow.

Having said that, I had a couple of teenagers stop by the house because their little brother came to play with my kid. The little brother wanted to show them my basement of GI Joes. We went down and these guys went straight to the pile of custom stuff I've got on my table and the one they liked the most was the custom fig that Obi did at Custom Con for me.

They said they'd love to have something like that because it looks like CoD or Battlefield. kids want stuff that looks like what is on games and TV just like we wanted figures to look like the cartoons and comics.

There's a market, they just need to find it.
 

Giga Bread

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Can you elaborate on that?
Everyone will complain when they see previews but the amount of garbage that disappears at retail is astounding. I've seen plenty of people note how they begrudgingly have bought figures they didn't like.
 

Giga Bread

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I agree Hasbro has more statistical data on toys than we could imagine...they have to gear it towards kids in order to make it grow.

Having said that, I had a couple of teenagers stop by the house because their little brother came to play with my kid. The little brother wanted to show them my basement of GI Joes. We went down and these guys went straight to the pile of custom stuff I've got on my table and the one they liked the most was the custom fig that Obi did at Custom Con for me.

They said they'd love to have something like that because it looks like CoD or Battlefield. kids want stuff that looks like what is on games and TV just like we wanted figures to look like the cartoons and comics.

There's a market, they just need to find it.

Exactly. The line should focus on what kids want, not what is a perpetual circlejerk of nostalgia from older fans who will always buy what is put out there.
 

K-Tiger

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Aesthetically they should cater to kids. Figure construction should most assuredly err to the adult side. 5-PoA garbage can go piss up a rope.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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They said they'd love to have something like that because it looks like CoD or Battlefield. kids want stuff that looks like what is on games and TV just like we wanted figures to look like the cartoons and comics..
yup! So they either need to make toys based on the games and toons already out (do toons anything like COD or GIJOE even exist anymore?), or make toons/games based on the military toys already out. So far, both bases aren't being covered.

I think they tried with Renegades, but gave up WAY too soon. It's like they think if something doesn't catch on in a month it's a failure.

If Hasbro really wants GIJOE to take off, they need to make a bada$$ game like COD/Battlefield/etc. Not a halfa$$ed game either. They need a game that wows. You'll get kids and adult gamers. Make modern skins and ARAH skins.

I'd like to believe they know what they are doing, but clearly, they do not.
 

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I agree Hasbro has more statistical data on toys than we could imagine...they have to gear it towards kids in order to make it grow.

Having said that, I had a couple of teenagers stop by the house because their little brother came to play with my kid. The little brother wanted to show them my basement of GI Joes. We went down and these guys went straight to the pile of custom stuff I've got on my table and the one they liked the most was the custom fig that Obi did at Custom Con for me.

They said they'd love to have something like that because it looks like CoD or Battlefield. kids want stuff that looks like what is on games and TV just like we wanted figures to look like the cartoons and comics.

There's a market, they just need to find it.
Giant wall o' text coming, Please forgive me...:

That's why I posted this very issue in the "toys you'd like to see" thread.

With video games being such a HUGE market, why is this market almost completely ignored for 1:18th ?. You'd get both adults and kids all over it.

Yes, they do have some figures, but their almost all HUGE ass Mcfarlane scale, with almost no POA. That, or the small ass Mega Block Lego scale. Heck, our hobby has become so popular now, we have that "Toyhunter" show. The companies (except for Dr. Who and the ReAction guys, and a few others) mostly aim at movie tie ins ?.

My Wal Mart has a large area of Iron Man/Avengers/Spiderman sections, that's filled to the brink with peg warmers. And the Star Wars area is an absolute joke. And I can't help but think that a lot of it has to do with their $10.00 price point for just one small fig.

As I am a toy geek, and a gamer, and have been for probably longer than most have even been alive here, I just don't get how they can just ignore a huge and profitable section of their marketing. Kids, teens, young adults, and even us "old farts"; would love and adore having these characters as 1:18th figures (and vehicles), that we love in video games. It just baffles me to no end.

Where are the CoD figs ?. Where are the Battlefield figs ? No Destiny figs ?. No Bioshock figs ?. No vehicles or playsets for them ?. But Wal Mart has three four foot sections for way over priced Minecraft toys ?.

I never thought I'd live to see the day where I'd ever walk into a toy section of a large store, and not see even one G.I. Joe figure, vehicle, playset...whatever. None whatsoever. :(

But we have 20 variants of Iron Man/Bat Man almost just alone.

That's just sad. :crying:

When my Gaming clan loved my toy skits for modern gaming, and wanted more, I had to go the PTE line, because almost no one else was making modern vehicles, figures, and playsets. And they sold like crazy at my store, for the last few years.

I just don't get it.
 
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G.I.*EDDIE

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My Wal Mart has a large area of Iron Man/Avengers/Spiderman sections, that's filled to the brink with peg warmers. And the Star Wars area is an absolute joke. And I can't help but think that a lot of it has to do with their $10.00 price point for just one small fig.
It also doesn't help that they are getting less and less articulated and the same characters are repeated over and over for that $10 (or more).

I swear it's like they are intentionally trying to kill the hobby/market.
 

Videoviper

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Elaborate on that.
HT & other Joe sites have mostly adults on them almost 0 active kids, When we found out one of the posters (on another site) was an actual kid, we realized exactly how much inappropriate sh!t we exposed him to because we thought he was just another 40 something.

As a parent I wouldn't want my kid on some of these sites, so online there is only Hasbro marketing Joe to kids. As much as we hate on HT for some of the stuff they do, truth be told juvenile adults "collectors" run off most of the would be next generation collectors. & to build the brand you need a safe area on line for kids to learn more about their favorite toys.

In theory, but wouldn't that kid just play a video game version of G.I. JOE?
Yes, video games & Cartoons are really the same thing as far as learning tools/advertising. The point is not why they are interested as we all like different things, but that they are interesting & invested in the product.

But does this make $ense for Hasbro?
I know I've been told I'm wrong on this; but the club & Hasbro are partners in the same thing. If the club makes money off GI Joe then Hasbro will. Hasbro controls how their brand is used. (If they don't they could lose legal rights to it.) So if they sell the 80-90s stuff through the club Hasbro gets their share.


I personally don't see why Hasbro can't give us more Direct to DVD animated flicks. That would be hot.
Bring it on, they did make several direct to DVD movies, which didn't do as well as they hoped, But its a good way to make a pilot for a series & still sell toys.
Renegades major issue was that there were no toys on the shelves when it aired, The show did OK as a show but without product to sell, the investment can't pay off, unless someone else says we really like the show & want to buy a 2nd season, which wasn't happening.
 

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Renegades biggest issue was it was on The Hub, and most cable markets did not carry The Hub. My kids watch Renegades quite a bit now. It's on my home server, used to be on Netflix for a bit. They also love GI Joe Resolute.
 

Videoviper

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My points are more of a business view not a fan view. Yes the hub having limited access to viewers was a problem, but that's also why they were able to get the programming block that they did. We never would see a transformers/GI Joe/ My Little Pony/ Hasbro product show here 4 hour block of programming on any other channel. (Maybe Nick would be interested in 1 show but not all of them.

The hub experiment was what it is, it would have been nice to grow it into something more but then again, you can't rebrand a channel if that channel isn't already on the downward slope, which Discovery kids was.

Your kids love the show, & I believe more kids would watch the show if given the chance. But what is needed for Hasbro's point of view

Someone who can make GI Joe relevant again.
Someone who can build relationships & get a TV show, online & off line media campaign, franchising rights to video games, possible movie interest (DVD or theatre). In the 80's it still took 3 years to build what they did before we ever saw product, & the show was just a TV movie split into 3 eps the 1st year.

They need to build a long term plan & in the business arena that is a much tougher sell then most fans realize.
 

Fred Broca

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They need to build a long term plan & in the business arena that is a much tougher sell then most fans realize.
If you listen to Kevin Smith's Fatman on Batman podcasts, there's a inside dope on "sausage making," in terms on what criteria the exes based their decisions, why certain things get green lit, why they don't, and why shows get cancelled.

Smith and Paul Dini were either talking about the newest Batman animated show or some other show and they mentioned that even though the show was good, it got cancelled. Dini say it was because the related merchandise wasn't moving fast enough. To which Smith said that the show should have been given a chance and the merchandise should have been built around the popular characters in the show.

I agree Videoviper, (and this is assuming that Hasbro hasn't.) Just like with Marvel, there needs to be a long range plan that goes beyond the next three financial quarters, along with an acceptable amount of money that Hasbro is willing to lose.

Again citing the Fatman on Batman podcast with Joe Quesada, he said that when he was brought on to either do Marvel Knights or when he was given the Editor-in-Chief's job at Marvel, one of the first things he did was figure out how to create a universe.

That's what Hasbro needs to do, create a universe. Find out what "makes it's it go." Go into the achieves and look at the market research data and see why JOEs moved all of that product in the 80's. Possibly speak to somebody at Marvel and ask this question, "how did you guys create a successful movie franchise based on your B and C list characters"? Assuming that they haven't, go to Larry Hama and ask "How did you manage to get a 155 issue run of a comic based on a toy? And finally, get a creative consultant with knowledge of advertising and marketing, but is also a JOE fanboy for his input.

The superhero genre is all the rage now because Hollywood has finally figured out that it's best to let people who are familiar with the source material either write and direct the stories when they're translated to other media and in certain instances let them head those respective departments. Being a layman who knows nothing about the ins and out of corporate business, it seems to me that this would be the best course of action for Hasbro, especially after seeing the success that Marvel is having.

If Hasbro had went this route, then we probably wouldn't have gotten RoC. Would we have gotten an Iron Man, Winter Solider, or Avengers, who knows? However, I will say that it would have been better to have a shitty JOE movie based on the source material as to some vastly sub par shit that has you saying to yourself, "They actually thought this was better than the comic?

The thing is whether it's Joe Colton, the JOEs we grew up with, or some new incarnation, G. I. JOE is a simple ass story to tell, so simple that all you have to do is write the damn story and insert the code names. Despite all of the naysayers, I feel that the JOEs have a lot of compelling stories that can be told and a JOEverse in other media could give Disney and Warner Bros. a run for their money if the property is handled properly. The question is whether or not will Hasbro have the balls to do it.

Off topic. For fun reading, if go to another message board, put in my user name or goggle "Why Even Use Real American Heroes for This Movie?," "Why Are You Going to See This Movie?" or google, Rise of COBRA Sucks, it's not only humorous, but baffling at how JOE Stans put on the cape for RoC, and passionately (and in my hella biased opinion,) argued that RoC was an good interpretation of the JOE mythos, it was accurate, and how they attempted to rationale certain decisions as far casting and the plot. What's really funny is when guys actually said that RoC was better than TDKR. I will say one thing though, at time it was announced, dudes weren't happy with JGL being cast as C.C. Mainly because people only knew him as "the kid from 3rd Rock From the Sun.

Even I feel that he was too young to be C.C. and considering what he has become as an actor, JGL would have been a dope C.C. if he would have been better material to work with. However, I still say and will argue to the end of time that Channing Tatum had no business in a JOE movie.