GI JOE 3 - SNAKE EYES

nacho

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Well, they smooshed all the hasbro franchises together in the comics, and it really ruined Joe, IMO. Only the first issue of the new joe series is out, but it's bad... just terrible. Skywarp on the Joe team? It removes all pretense of military realism and shoves it so far up science fiction's ass that I don't recognize it. Le sigh.

I don't get too worked up over the films, as I know they aren't going to be "my" Joe, no matter what. Any movie is going to be some over the top action movie, trying to appeal to a much wider audience, and that's fine. But I've long since gotten past the age where I'm going to get worked up over it. If Ripcord can be a Wayans, anything can happen - yeah, I went there, and it only took one post ;)
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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Right there with ya, nacho. I know they aren't going to make what I want to see, so I really don't care anymore.
 

Giga Bread

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I love the early science fiction of Joe v. Cobra but I can't stand Transformers in the mix because they're so freaking overpowered. They'll probably do it as a Titanfall ripoff.
 

nacho

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Yeah, I have no problem with a laser trooper or even a "sci-fi" weather machine. But when you add in giant alien robots, it becomes a cosmos-spanning conflict rather than a half-way realistic attempt to protect god & country from car-salesman terrorists.

It ratchet's up the conflict so much that Joes basically have no place in it. Hasbro thinks it's a cool synergy to integrate all their properties. To me, it just makes them less special and unique.
 

Giga Bread

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Daredevil and Punisher on Netflix works because they aren't battling aliens with the Avengers.
 

NSA

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Yeah.. no thanks.. I liked Retaliation for the most part, because it didn't seem to take itself TOO seriously.

But whatever.. the ship has long sailed for that I think.

Maybe Trump can MAKE JOE GREAT AGAIN too lol
 

Joefan82

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I'd like to see what can be done with a crossover. Just wish the design of the Transformers was more closely related to the G1 cartoon and comic series.
 

Videoviper

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I took my nephew to see transformers 2, during the scene with Devistaor's "balls" we both looked at each other with an apoligetic look & realized we were both embarressed to be watching this.

I never saw a TF movie in theaters again.

If they could combine Joe & transformers not Bayformers which is a nightmare, then I would enjoy it especially if it was part of a surprise ending.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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If the TF's were G1 designs I'd be all over that! I don't care if the rest was typical Bay story/plot/explosions, just seeing the G1 designs represented as real on screen would be amazing.

I'm shallow. Had Superman been wearing his traditional costume in the new DC films, I would have loved them instead of loathing them.
 

K-Tiger

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... but why..

March? Is that when studios put stuff out to die?
Seems that way. A Joe movie would get blown the fuck out in a summer slot nine years out of ten.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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I have EXTREMELY



























low expectations for a new JOE film. So low that I fully expect it to be worse than the other two.
 

ThunderDan19

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I could swear I heard that same rumor waaaaaaay back in the 'Stank days.
 

NSA

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The Snake Eyes movie is supposed to film this fall and come out next October (2020) so this would be ANOTHER movie.. 2 GI JOE movies?!

IF (huge giant if) they could pull off a MCU and do individual JOE movies and then a big GI JOE movie with all the team.. that could be cool. I mean GI JOE is basically the Avengers of the military.
 

G.I.*EDDIE

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Except, GIJOE is always a team effort. Individual films seem, weird. At best they could do the small teams joining up for a finale.
 

zodiacflash

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I remember when Rise of Cobra came out. A friend at work said "Oh, man! It's awesome! It's exactly like the comic books. You'll love it!"

Last time I ever took movie advice from a chick.

I'm reminded of Kevin Smith's story about how he was asked to write a script for a new Superman movie, and he got a barrage of shit from the producers like, Why does he have a cape? Lose the cape, it's dumb. He gets his energy from the sun? No, no, that's no good. Put thrusters on his boots. He can get his ability to fly that way. It's almost like these guys spent their whole lives under a rock and never actually heard of Superman.

I assume the same thing happened with G.I. Joe. Someone wrote an awesome script, based in the early 1980's with a bad-ass team put together from all branches of the AMERICAN military, based in AMERICA, with the older and more experienced members being Vietnam vets (or change it to modern times, I can live with that). The mission, of course, is to defeat this new terrorist organization called Cobra that's running around fucking shit up and making relations more tense between east and west.

And then, the people who actually decide how movies are made got involved. The result was a piece of shit that I walked out of about 2/3rds through. I understand that you can't please all the old school die-hard fans, and nobody will ever be completely happy with your final product, but God damn, at least fucking TRY!!!!! And I can't watch Retaliation.

The only advice I can give... as much as I hate to say it, and hate to see it happen... Reboot.

And this time, make an actual G.I. Joe movie.

Maybe I'm just a grouch
 
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pcsguy88

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The one with the Rock and Bruce Willis was way better, but still severely lacking. How do you fuck up a movie with those two actors?!? Chuckles would be great (I do not remember him in any cartoon) if they took the Baywatch approach and just made Magnum PI fun of themselves the whole time. It’s really the only way I ever see Joe gaining an audience. Just parody the shit out of the ridiculous characters and plotlines.
 
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NSA

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I mean, why bother casting a known actor for someone who doesn't speak or show themselves? Maybe he knows Kung-fu? I liked him in Crazy Rich Asians, so I'm fine with it.

Really, at this point, none of the original GI JOE backstory makes any sense. Snake-eyes wasn't fighting in NAM anymore.. he'd be way too old. Sure, you could do a 1:1 age up with Iraq or something.. but.. meh.

Like pcsguy88 said, they need to go full Baywatch style and just make it FUN with lots of laughs. No one wants to see a gritty Black Hawk Down GI JOE movie (other than us). Rise of Cobra was too much a sci-fi weird tech movie.

If Marvel has taught me anything, you BUILD UP to the weirdness. Get people on-board with a semi-silly war/action movie, build the team, and then start working your way to MASS Devices and WEATHER CONTROL MACHINES and blue and red lasers.
 

ThunderDan19

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Henry Golding? He's so hot right now... :p

mugatu.jpg

Here's hoping they get it right this time. I am keeping my expectations extremely low...
 

NSA

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Yeah, we'll see.

Hoping they do good.

Ideally you'd have this movie focused on Snake Eyes and (I guess) Scarlet and probably Storm Shadow. Then have another movie that focuses on a couple other team members, and build up to a full team movie like AVENGERS or something.

Realistically, only old ass nerds like us would even KNOW the backstory behind any of the Joes at this point, so it makes more sense to re-introduce them first. I hope Cobra Commander gets an origin movie.
 

nacho

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Hama himself explained recently why Snake Eyes was intentionally made white... but hollywood cannot miss an opportunity to be extra-woke, so he's asian now. Let's at least hope he's still american.
 

Giga Bread

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I don’t care what race Snake Eyes is. I just want a good movie to revitalize the brand. It feels like it’s going to be an uphill battle since we’re getting another ninjafest for a military fiction line
 

NSA

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The race switching isn't super big to me, as Snake Eyes was always BLACK to me anyway as a kid (I only vaguely remember the Vietnam flashback comic where you see he was white).

And anyway, he's half white (Dad was English).

Also, the GI JOE origin stories don't really work anymore. Snake Eyes getting mute in THE NAM doesn't make much sense unless they make it an 80's period piece.

I'm okay with them updating things for modern times in that case.
 

nacho

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I don't know why they have to mention 'Nam specifically. It could be any mission gone wrong in any jungle or sandbox. I'm not sure it's even necessary to name the place or time. "5 years ago..."

Sure, the type of helo involved in the accident will date the events, but I think the more true to the classic origin they make it, the better, just being vague about the specifics... because they don't matter all that much. I mean, who cares if it was Nam, Laos, some island in the Philippines, or a jungle in south america? It's not important.
 

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I don't know why they have to mention 'Nam specifically. It could be any mission gone wrong in any jungle or sandbox. I'm not sure it's even necessary to name the place or time. "5 years ago..."

Sure, the type of helo involved in the accident will date the events, but I think the more true to the classic origin they make it, the better, just being vague about the specifics... because they don't matter all that much. I mean, who cares if it was Nam, Laos, some island in the Philippines, or a jungle in south america? It's not important.
I think it does matter if they're trying to re-invigorate the brand.

NAM to us in the 80s was a real thing, a real place, a real incident you could tie these Joes to that made them "more real" than some fantasy like Transformers I guess. Obviously GI JOE vs COBRA is made-up, but all the MOS descriptions on the file cards made JOE seem plausible and real.. which is something I really liked. If you make all their backstories make believe gobblygook like the 2009 movie kinda did.. there is a LOT less weight behind the property.

I'd retcon it to a helo accident in Iraq or Afghanistan since that's really the only plausible conflict I can think of for the time frame. Hell, the actor was born in 1987. Snake Eyes & Timber are 2 years older than he is!



The actor was... 14 when 9/11 happened. If he signed up at 18, that would have been 2005. Getting promoted/etc would take a couple of years. So....

March 29, 2010...

Velozia Air: Plane Crash Information & Aviation Safety Issues » US Army Blackhawk crashes in Afghanistan.

A U.S. Army helicopter crashed yesterday (March 29, 2010) near Forward Operating Base Atgar in the Zabul province of Afghanistan. Fourteen people were aboard the Sikorsky UH-60 Blackhawk and all survived the accident.

According to reports, the helicopter had just departed the forward base when it crashed. Officials are still unsure what happened, but suspect a mechanical failure may be behind the crash. They have ruled out an enemy attack as the result of the crash. The Taliban, naturally, disagrees; claiming to have shot down the helicopter.

Thirteen of the fourteen people aboard the helicopter suffered injuries. Eleven US servicemen suffered injuries along with two Afghan soldiers. One Afghan soldier did not suffer any injuries.
Plausible time-frame..
 
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ThunderDan19

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The (mostly) plausible backstories, MOS's, uniforms/kits and vehicles/weapons (at least at the beginning) were a huge draw for me as well, as opposed to the pure fantasy of Star Wars and He-Man and the crazy sci-fi of Transformers. I think Joe would need a serious, creative and military experienced team on the order of Hama, Rudat et. al., plus a seriously popular video game, movie and/or online presence to truly revive the franchise today.
 

Giga Bread

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I think they’re angling for that tried and true, pit fighter with passing military experience turned vigilante, trying to find his father’s killer storyline. You know. For idiots.
 

NSA

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Honestly, the A-Team movie from a decade ago was the best GI JOE movie I've seen.

They felt like wacky, but plausible soldiers, who were doing stuff off the normal chain of command (in this case because they were framed for a crime they didn't commit..).

Going with Rocket Powered SuperSuits in RoC was a mistake. The follow up movie was BETTER.. but still not right.

How hard could it be, you have so many comics/etc to pull idea from.
 

ThunderDan19

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All they need are the right people that are motivated to do the work to make it what it can be... Oh, and money, lots and lots of money... :p
 

nacho

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Honestly, the A-Team movie from a decade ago was the best GI JOE movie I've seen.

They felt like wacky, but plausible soldiers, who were doing stuff off the normal chain of command (in this case because they were framed for a crime they didn't commit..).

Going with Rocket Powered SuperSuits in RoC was a mistake. The follow up movie was BETTER.. but still not right.

How hard could it be, you have so many comics/etc to pull idea from.
I love that A-Team movie... I saw on the on-screen guide that it's on some cable channel tonight, and I started to wonder if it's ok for my now-13-year-old. However, per imdb, the language is pretty rough. I'm sure the boy hears worse at school, but I don't exactly want to normalize it.

There are so many movies I want to watch with that kid when he's just a few years older, "The Jerk" being primary among them. "I was born a small black child..."
 

Giga Bread

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I actually hate Retaliation just about as much and the only positive it has over ROC, is the characters actually wore military gear.

copied from a recent post I sent to a friend one night while it was playing in the background.
"SS poses as SE and assassinates the Pakistani prime minister. They capture him and leave his mask and armor on him until they put him in a container, with his swords outside. Of course, unmasking him should immediately exonerate GI Joe, but no. Storm Shadow frees CC and uses his fake ass SE swords that were conveniently left in the sealed off room, setting off the world threatening events (as if assassinating a prime minister of a nuclear power isn’t). In the mountains, SE and SS fight. SE wins and takes SS to the Blind Master for ninja justice. SS is redeemed and says he was framed. He’s now a good guy."

This is the core of the problem with bad adaptations. It's not about dedication to the source at this point. A halfway decent script doesn't require source material. You can write an awesome plot, and insert the references you need later on. When they rebooted Fantastic Four. The reason the movie is bad is not because the Human Torch is black. It's because it started as a shitty movie. The great action movies we grew up on were born from screenplays. They weren't born from a press release like all of these tentpole films. Die Hard started as a script for Commando 2. It's a good action script. It didn't need Arnold reprising a role. Now, they announce a budget and film for a franchise before they even have a script.

From what I've read about the Snake Eyes origin movie, I like that it's at least starting as a revenge film because eventhough it breaks from the core of the character we grew up on, if done right, narratively can explain why he isn't a revenge seeking type of character and further strengthens the rivalry he has with Storm Shadow. What I don't like is the 90's straight to video plotline of streetfighting by day, investigating a father's murder by night.


I've accepted my perception of what makes Snake Eyes a good character has no bearing on his/her future development. When they went full ninja, I loved it because I was a dumb kid. I miss the commando though. I liked the deus ex commando SE in the early comics who was just the guy that slip a clip in his boot when they needed it. I like the idea that deep down, he's a special forces guy who takes risks and has a dark facade that hides a lot of pain and remorse. I don't need Phantom of the Ninja Opera. I like that after a few years, they discovered his hidden tattoo that links him to Storm Shadow. It's like his prince albert and doesn't need to be embossed all over his military gear. I guess eventually the Arashikage will learn about branding and start selling merchandise to make money instead of killing political figures.

Anyways. While I think it gets ridiculous how often in America we make fictional ninjas and martial artists white, I think I can see through the choice of making SE Asian for what it is. It's a very passive progressive move. Here in the US, they'll be applauded for it. But it's to make that precious precious Chinese bank.

A-Team the movie should be a national treasure. I thought everyone was great in that. Even the guy replacing Mr. T as BA.
 

NSA

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I actually hate Retaliation just about as much and the only positive it has over ROC, is the characters actually wore military gear.

Anyways. While I think it gets ridiculous how often in America we make fictional ninjas and martial artists white, I think I can see through the choice of making SE Asian for what it is. It's a very passive progressive move. Here in the US, they'll be applauded for it. But it's to make that precious precious Chinese bank.

A-Team the movie should be a national treasure. I thought everyone was great in that. Even the guy replacing Mr. T as BA.
I feel like I've only seen Retaliation once in theaters, I don't even own it, so maybe I'd like it less on repeated viewings. How you can have the ROCK and Bruce Willis in a movie and not have it be great is amazing. The Rock himself is like instant success. They must really suck.

And yes, A-Team was perfect. That movie is so much fun. I felt like every character lived up to the original in just the right way. Didn't replace them, didn't mimic or mock them.. but felt natural just as they were. I am still sad it didn't make the money it should have. Would have loved 2 or 3 more.
 

Videoviper

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Back in the marvel comics days they were really lobbying to spin Snake Eyes off onto his own comic
frees up GI Joe to push the new toys
gives Marvel another popular comic

unfortunately issue rights with characters from transformers comics (non transformers characters appearing for the 1st time in tf comics) ciriut breaker, death’s head 1/2

so Hasbro never green lit a se comics series.

however this movie sounds more like a se movie than a Joe movie. I hope they develop different teams wi the plan to bring the teams together later.